This may be an unusual post, in that I am going to show some, shall we say, 'less than perfect' painting results. I may be drummed out of the blogging society for this, but I think I'm keeping with the spirit of my hobby. .I'm doing my best, making mistakes, hopefully learning lessons, enjoying it, and maybe getting better bit by bit. If I only showed perfect results I'd have nothing to show here! So, you have been warned - here are the latest 'learning opportunities'...
Picardie:
It took a while, but I finished painting my first Seven Years War French Infantry - a couple of 'Portable Wargame' units of the Picardie regiment. These are nice Garrison figures, supplied by the excellent Rob Young of The Eastern Garrison - thanks very much, Rob! I liked them - rather more elegant and less 'chunky' than the vintage Minifigs I have been painting up to now for the period. So here is a view of them - 'Button Counters' need not look too closely, as I have not painted on any buttons...
gentlemen from Picardie.. |
However, 'belt counters' may well be clutching at their pearls, as I will admit I have made a mistake with the crossbelts. Two factors : (a) colour, and (b) arrangement. As to colour, I took a steer from the Kronoskaf website, which states that crossbelts were natural leather (often whitened with pipe-clay) - I decided my chaps would want to be smart, and use the white. But then all the examples I've seen in other illustrations ( such as a nice plate in an edition of Tradition picked up the Broadside show ) tend to show the natural leather look, so I may be out on a limb here. Yesterday I acquired the Osprey Men-At-Arms no.302 Louis XV's Army (2) French Infantry, which states that 'from the later 1750s a growing number of regiments whitened their belts', which maybe gets me off the hook. Where I have a bigger problem is the arrangement of belts - with a slight shortage of documentary sources initially, I rather rashly assumed they would have the classic 'two belts crossed over' , whereas I now see that in reality they more likely had a single shoulder belt for the cartridge box, with a waist belt for sword and bayonet scabbards. Oops. I suppose I could try to re-paint the extra belt into the 'Grey-White' coat colour, but for the moment I am going to leave them, and assume a rather eccentric Colonel has provided non-regulation equipage - or 'liberated' crossbelts from fallen Prussians, perhaps? . Further units ( I have another two or three lots still to do ) will revert to the single belt. possibly in buff leather for good measure.
Having said that, I was otherwise quite pleased with them; I kept them in my very simple and rather old-school 'house style' ('cos that's all I can do!); I think I got the 'grey-white' about right, and it will distinguish them nicely from the pure white of my Austrians and Saxons. I hit upon the trick of using a fine-line black pen to outline those belts (thus highlighting my mistake, oops!) and to do the garters at the knee, and I will use that again, it worked pretty well. I even managed to get the flags more or less to my satisfaction - made from good old wine bottle-top foil, painted with acrylics, and which may be shaped a bit to give an impression of fluttering in the breeze - they are only temporarily attached for the camera. Not too bad for a first go, and I hope the next batch will be better - onwards and upwards, etc.
Piedmont
Now a complete change of tack - both period and scale. A bit of a first for me: I have had a go at some 6mm figures. Since acquiring Neil Thomas' fine book Wargaming 19th Century Europe I have been thinking about that period, and the wars of Italian unification or Risorgimento (memories of history teacher Mr Davis intoning that word in his mellifluous Welsh tones, c.1976 - it must have stuck somehow) seemed an interesting and colourful setting (and balanced - no dour Prussians winning all the time!). At 'Salute' I picked up a nice book on the subject, Gabriele Esposito's Armies of the Italian Risorgimento, which has lots of inspiring contemporary illustrations of the uniforms of the time. I also took a punt on buying some figures, having decided to give 6mm a try for this period, as a bit of an experiment. That nice Mr. Berry at Baccus was happy to oblige with a few packs of figures, so I now have some Piedmontese and Austrian infantry, and some artillery pieces. As a first attempt, I tried putting together a Piedmontese infantry unit ( a battalion? Neil Thomas is deliberately vague ).
For painting advice, Baccus has quite a useful page on their website, the crucial point being 'paint the unit, not the figure' - don't get caught up trying to paint the detail that no-one will ever see at this scale! Armed with that, I plunged in - and I reckon the advice is good.
From the Risorgimento book I found this plate (above, centre) showing a Piedmontese Line Infantryman, post-1849, and that looked a nice simple and pleasing colour scheme. Immediately a slight problem arose, in that the picture shows a man in single-breasted tunic, but if you squint hard and look closely, the Baccus figures are in longer coats, probably greatcoats! No pic of those in the book, so I made an assumption that the long coats would be basically the same blue colour - fingers crossed. Following the Baccus 'cheat sheet', I found I could fairly whizz along with painting, especially as I was only doing 8 strips of figures - a total of just 32 men. Having done a basic job, and given them equally, er, basic bases, I have a unit. A bit rough around the edges ( and a lesson learned about sticking them to the base before trying to paint the green on - I won't do that in future, and will probably end up re-basing these! ), but I reckon they will do fine. I reckon I could knock out serviceable ( for me) units at a satisfyingly high rate..
HOWEVER of course, when I came to photograph them, I ran into the problem with modern cameras - they are far too good! Took this on my phone:
and they look terrible, don't they? Click on the pic to look closely - overlapping paint everywhere, green base colour all over the place.. BUT also note, if you click on the pic to look at them closely, you are seeing them as about 25mm tall - 4 times their actual size! No-one will EVER see them like that in reality, short of picking them up and putting them under a magnifier - and if you do that, you will NOT be invited back... I think a more realistic view is something like this ( and no clicking!)
Looking at them like that, I am not unhappy for a first and rather hasty attempt- I'll re-do the bases, though. And I do hope to get a bit better at painting them too, with practise. Following a hint from Neil Thomas' book, I have kept the figures on two of the bases in their strips, representing a 'reserve' part of the unit in closer order, while the other two bases have the strips chopped up and spaced out a bit, to represent skirmish order. Here the unit is in 'Line' formation as per Neil's rules, with in effect a skirmish line out front and a formed-up reserve behind, ready for the glorious bayonet charge..
As I said these are Baccus 6mm, largely because they were what I could buy on impulse at Salute. - but I admit I actually rather like the look of the range of 'semi-flat' MDF 6mm figures from Commission Figurines - you can see them in use on recent blogs such as Wargames with Toy Soldiers 1685-1845 by Steve J, and My Wargaming Habit by Richard, of Postie's Rejects fame. Commission do a Napoleonic range and an ACW range, and I think both could come in quite handy for the Risorgimento, - British shakos for Austrians, for example, and ACW Kepis for Garibaldi's redshirts? the figures have a rather stylised look and minimal detail, which I think will make 'paint conversions' very possible.
It so happens I picked up some of their ACW figures at a show in
pre-Covid times, and here are some - posed in front of the Baccus
Piedmontese, we have a base of kepi-wearing Union and one of
slouch-hatted Johnny Rebs :
Commission Figurines ACW in front of Baccus Piedmontese |
Sadly it looks like one of the Reb's musket has turned into a shotgun with the barrel 'broken', but think I might be on to something here! I think the two different makes of figure don't look too different in size, so should go together on the table without problems. Given the 'mission creep' factor ( hmm.. when will the D-Day Dodgers actually get a game? And those Picardie chaps? ), any such project needs to be quick and cheap, and I think 6mm with Neil Thomas rules may just fit the bill. Much to think about, then..
*** UPDATE :***
After a little thought, I decided to re-do the Piedmontese infantry basing as shown in this picture:
I simply reduced the number of figures on the 'skirmish' bases to 4 instead of 8, so they look a bit more of a loose formation. They are not 'stuck down' yet, but I am happier with them - and there is a small bonus in that with 24 figures per unit rather than 32, I should get four units out of my pack of 96 Baccus figures, rather than only three. So, more efficient too!
And while I'm here, many thanks to Jon at Palouse Wargaming Journal for mentioning this post in his latest!
*** update ends.. ***
As I said, not a parade of Picardie and Piedmont perfection, but I hope this has been interesting. Next week, maybe even some gaming - he said, yet again.. Also a return visit to Duxford is planned, to include the 'Land Warfare' hall - should be lots of wargaming interest there! I will give a full report, I hope. Meanwhile, keep well, everyone.
David,
ReplyDeleteI think you are being too harsh on yourself.
Who are you painting for? You or your admiring public?
What are you aiming for? A wargames unit or army or collector standard display piece?
Piedmont look perfectly serviceable, "mistakes" and all; neat and tidy.
People notice faces, flags (and shields) and bases and fill in the rest.
Concentrate on them if you want to impress.
Mistakes. Happens all the time. Keep pictures nearby to help with the bits you are unsure of. I use one of those cooking book rests that are clear plastic. Holds book upright and protects from splashes.
When you discover an error, can you live with it? Sometimes I can, sometimes I have to correct it because it bugs me. I made several mistakes when painting my early SK SSMs, but can't face repainting and while I'm aware, it doesn't bother me. However, my IDF / Jordanians have had several remakes. Discovered my French line for F&IW have all discoloured due to varnish. I've settled on repairs and touching up the flags....
6mm. Always difficult. If you are happy with them, that's fine.
A black undercoat may be an option; it hides the bits you miss but is more difficult to "read" the figure.
If they bug you, try an Army Painter wash - dark tone or strong tone then do tiny touch ups / highlights just on raised areas.
Neil
Many thanks Neil, that is all good advice! I was maybe over-thinking a bit, have re-edited the first paragraph to calm it down a bit. Your questions are good, and the answers are (i) painting for me, (ii) aiming for wargames, not collector level!
DeleteI think that having put up pics on a blog, some viewers may think 'these aren't as good as in the magazines/glossy rulebooks, why is he bothering?' ( I find those diorama-quality pics in print rather de-motivating rather than inspiring - and I want an army, not a skirmish! ) I am obviously not a great painter - but I am hoping to say 'look, these are OK, I am happy with them, you don't have to paint like in the magazines, if I can do this, so can you... There was a brilliant article in a very early 'Miniature Wargames' on this subject, which has been my inspiration ever since, I must blog about it some time!
Mistakes? Well, I will probably live with them, just try to do better next time. I was a bit under-researched on those crossbelts! The 6mm bases however, will get re-done - paint the green on the figure base, and on the cardboard base, before attaching one to the other, rather than struggling to paint between figures afterwards!
With 6mm I suspect the biggest problem is simply that the camera shows them in minute and enlarged detail, which would just not be possible on the table! The trick is probably to take 'worse' ( but more realistic ) photos.. and to show them as an army, not as individual figures. I think the terrain suddenly beomes important, too.. Anyway I'll see how I get on. Many thanks again, your comments are always interesting and useful!
I see I mixed Picardy and Piedmont.....
DeleteI must admit I could care less about what people think, just because it's on a blog.....
I'm still amazed I get positive comments about SSM on green balsa bases, or indeed that anyone follows my blog!
I set it up to help me motivate myself and check progress.
As to the glorious painted figures that inhabit magazines and the web - all very nice but a long way from what most people do.
I've just come off a meeting of the VWC - there are some superb painters on there, but most of us are average to good and what's nice is, it doesn't stop us sharing pictures. We were treated to an old WRG 5th ed Minifigs Republican Roman army started in 1976!
I have maybe 42 years painting experience. I used to paint functionally, to get armies and units finished. Living remotely, my ancient armies were painted mostly with Humbrol gloss enamel, thinned down with white spirit. I found Humbrol matt visiting the nearest city. I once painted two units in a hurry for a game and slapped on some artists varnish I had which dried in white blotches. After that, I vowed to paint better and used Peter Gilder's guide in Military Modelling. Later switched to acrylics and moved from washes to black undercoat, before it was trendy. Ended up painting layers, but struggled to finish armies as it took so long. The point of that ramble? There are many ways to paint figures, but it all comes down to aesthetics and time. Anyone can paint a couple of figures really well, but armies need compromises....
Neil
David, like in most matters, I agree with Neil completely! Paint in the manner and style that suits you. Paint buttons; don't paint buttons, it is all your choice.
DeleteIf I was worried about what others thought of my painted figures, I may not post any photos. From many years at this, I find that 99% of all bloggers are very courteous and encouraging on any figures put out on display. Besides, I really do not care much for many of the painting styles I see in the glossy mags. I may be alone, though, but that is OK.
Keep doing what you are doing and as long as you are satisfied, that is really all that matters.
I do provide natural leather webbing to my SYW/WAS French though...
Thanks again Neil, a very interesting painting 'life story'! I am old enough to have used plenty of Humbrol enamels in childhood - what with that and the poly cement, were we all off our heads a lot of the time?!
DeleteI too am very pleasantly surprised to get so many freindly comments, I think that has been a major boost, and I also find blogging to be a great motivator - you need to have done something in order to blog about it! And it works as a sort of diary/archive for my own reference, too.
I strongly agree it's a balance, you can paint very detailed figures but you won't get an army done like that, and I want an army, not a skirmish..
and thanks Jon, I heartily agree with you too! I think I will do the natural leather belts on future French infantry, it does make a nice distinguishing sign between them and Austrians, Saxons etc. ( must have another go at some more Saxons with the SSM figures Neil generously gave me..)
DeleteI think they look fine David. I wouldn't worry about the cross belts. The French were notorious for not following central instructions, either through logistics or colonel's taste. The soldiers look very old school, and fit well with the Portable Wargame concept. Unless you're going for full on Peter Guilder style terrain, going for accurate and realistic painting is like spending a fortune on a house in a back street and expecting to get your money back on a sale.
ReplyDeleteBy the way, I was expecting two SYW regiments because of the title. I thought the second would naturally be Regiment Piedmont! Maybe that should be your next?
Thanks Chris, indeed I think I am puttng those crossbelts down to rugged Gallic individuality! I am happy with 'old school', I like the vintage figures and it's a nice nostalgia trip, back to a world I was too young and didn't have the money to really join at the time! 'Accurate and realistic' are trigger words, aren't they? Alert - 'WRG, Newbury Rules and Bruce Quarrie incoming' (!)
DeleteI see there was indeed a Piedmont regiment - maybe I should do as you say!
Well they look fine to me and I paint with the '3 foot rule' in mind, so that they look good and 'pop' when on the table, Yes when seen close up and through the unforgiving lens of modern digital photography, they look very blobby with daubed on colours, but for me and my ageing eyes, they work prefectly well on the table. Afterall these days it's all about getting toys on the table for me to a level I'm happy with and frankly that's all that matters.
ReplyDeleteThanks for the Blog mention, ditto Richard's Blog, who has a different appraoch to basing his figures to me, but it shows that can be done with Walt's excellent smei-flat figures. The Unification book is great and I'm sure with simple and bright paint jobs the mdf figures would easily 'convert' to multiple Nations etc.
Thanks Steve, absolutely right the '3 foot rule' is what counts. Given we are playing the role of say, a Divisional commander in our games, I'd be very worried if he was close enough to the enemy to count their buttons :) And it's all about getting units on the table in sufficient numbers.
DeleteI really liked your Commission Figurines 'Red' and 'Blue' armies, only too happy to give you a plug!
I wouldn't worry overmuch about mistakes - whether of choice of colours, design, or execution. For one thing, slight blips in execution are likely as not to add character to a unit. For the other, what you get in books on uniforms and such are really 'best guesses'.
ReplyDeleteI am reminded of a comment by, I think it was John D. Imboden, CSA. He reckoned that during the whole war he saw but one soldier wearing immaculate regulation uniform. Artillery uniform. The man in question was serving in the infantry at the time... Wellington allowed that is didn't much care what his mean wore, so long as it wasn't enemy uniform. That didn't stop his men wearing items of enemy uniform...
I reckon those Picardy fellows look the business, all right. A fine war games unit. The size of the figures pictures is about that of a 25mm figure held less than 6 inches from the eye. That is bound to show up lines that have gone a little astray. Remember the two-foot rule!
Cheers,
Ion
Thanks Ion, and of course you are right about sources too, they cannot be 100% sure, at least before the age of colour photography.. I like the anecdotes from Imboden and Wellington!
DeleteGlad you like the Picardy chaps, and good point about how photos on screen look. Indeed the two (or three) foot rule is the main thing.
They look fine to me. There is too much tyranny going on in blogdom re painting talent, skills and perfection. I for one , have neither the skill or desire to spends hours on a figure. Be proud of your efforts and I look forward to seeing them in action…
ReplyDeleteAlan Tradgardland
Thanks Alan, I agree and think the more 'normal' standard figures get shown the better. I want a reasonable-looking unit on the table, and hopefully am just about doing that, in a reasonable timescale!
DeleteI agree with the other commentators, you are painting for yourself and to get armies on the table.
ReplyDeleteI have been taking this exact approach with my tyw epic project. Treat the sprite of figures as a whole, rather than concentrating on individual figures. That way I get a complete unit finished in 3-4 hours.
Thanks Mike, you are entirely right! And your 30YW 'Epic' troops look good, I do like your 'paint the unit' approach, it just 'feels right', and I can;t argue with 3-4 hours for a regiment!
DeleteI think the whole 'beautifully painted 28mm figure as wargame standard' comes from the glossy mags. I enjoy layer painting of 28mm figures for skirmishes but paint more simply for units as the only time people can see the detail is when they pick them up and peer at them! I'd suggest that units painted in a more basic style look better on the table as they look 'less cluttered', ie the main parts of the uniform stand out more. And 6mm are definitely about painting en masse. You wouldn't want to look too closely at mine but they look ok on the battlefield. Better than ok, I'd venture as a table of 6mm looks more like a battlefield to me. Neal is right about a black undercoat, though I use a thinned black so missed bits are still black but it is easier to see the detail than it would be with solid matt black. Keep going the way that suits you!
ReplyDeleteThanks Brian, yes indeed I think the magazines have promoted that 'very detailed 28mm' standard, I suppose it's understandable as they want to print what they see as attractive pictures. I agree with your 'less clutter' point, I remember another blogger saying that he always tries to paint figures using as few different colours as he can - that has stuck with me!
DeleteAnd regarding 6mm you make a very good point, the overall battlefield becomes the important thing. I saw one of Bruc Weigle's 6mm games at a show a few years ago, it looked fantastic!
Good point re: black undercoat, I think the Baccus painting guide suggested that too. As it happened I had primed the Piedmontese with grey, but may give black a try for the next lot..
David, I can only add to the chorus from other bloggers—they look great! Those 'toy soldier'-style Seven Year's War French look simply beaut, especially for the period. Your first foray into the smaller scale has yielded some fine results. Keep going as we look forward to seeing more!
ReplyDeleteYou see, far from 'being drummed out of the blogging society' you've uncovered the best part of it—*everyone* appreciates and encourages one another's efforts. We are all in it for the personal joy, having a go, putting it in a blog as a personal record, but also to show to other, like-minded people. I think we all love the vicarious joy of seeing different styles and celebrating the range of approaches to painting, types and scale of figures, terrain, rules, eras... just enjoying the multitude that is in the hobby.
Modern cameras. Aren't they a double-edged sword?
I look at my figs, even with glasses on, and think, "They look pretty good". Then I take some photos and look at them. Oh my goodness, "They don't look that bad, really. Do they?!" The camera does not 'lie', but it can be used to better or worse effect. I have come to the truism of photography: it is about lighting, lighting, lighting (then composition, focus, equipment). If I want to feel better about the images, I try to photograph my figs in daylight only. Also taking care with the focal point as well as the background and surface, since the camera can focus on a rough base, cover sheet, or whatever and make a really smeared image. In the end, my painting is not good enough for a 'forensic', modern camera, but it is the best that I can do, works for table top recognition and I enjoy having a go.
Your painting is much better!
Regards, James
Thank you so much James, you make a very good point, and I have been quite touched by the nice messages from you and several others. Indeed this is the best part of blogging!
DeleteGood comments about cameras too. I wonder if maybe the trick is to give the photos a slightly 'impressionist', not-too-detailed look, as well as the figures!
You are too kind about my painting, I just looked at some of yours on your blogs ( those 54mm WW2, and recent Napoleonic Saxons and Duchy of Warsaw ) - they look pretty dam' good!